S1E20 - Ape Escape 2

Welcome back to another episode of Discreed Error, the podcast where every week we dive into the extensive and fascinating library of the greatest selling video game console of all time, the PlayStation Two. I'm Derek Kicker.

I'm Ian Golding.

And this week, we're going wild with Ape Escape Two for sequel month.

OOH.

Ape escape two.

Sequel month continues.

Question for you. Did you ever play APESCAPE? One.

No.

You didn't play Escape One.

Was that on?

I get this PlayStation One.

I get this confused with Super Monkey Ball.

It's very different.

I know it's very different, but I still get them confused because they're obviously the titles. Yeah.

I guess it's not like a wildly different animation style. No, I played Ape Escape One. I Loved Ape escape One.

Loves it.

I was a big fan. I do remember it was the first game on PlayStation One that you had to have a dual shot controller to play.

Oh, wow. Okay.

Yeah. Because the controls for APESCAPE One and Two are the exact same. But if you don't have the joysticks, you literally cannot do anything oh, wow. At all.

Wow.

So I remember I rented it from Blockbuster. Shout out to the former Blockbuster in Garden Grove, California.

Shout out.

And I was like, super into Crash Bandicoot at this time, too.

Okay. Yeah.

And this just hit that sweet spot.

Yeah.

I was like, Hell yeah. Let's go.

Ape Escape. Ape escape time.

Ape Escape. Well, Ape Escape Two came out in North America on June 30, 2003, almost a full year after it was released in Japan.

Wow. This happens a lot.

I think it's localization. Yeah. In the EU version, the Powell version came out a little earlier in March of 2003.

That used to be a thing they'd have to do pal and fucking NTSC. Yeah. Now it's just, whatever.

Well, and there's two different Ntscs, right? There's ntscj and NTSC. USC, which can't us and Canada. You can play this game now on the PlayStation Four or Five. It's available in the PS Classics collection. But very interesting. And I can't figure out why they did this. That version is the Pal version.

Interesting.

And you can tell immediately because A the voice acting, but also all the characters names are the same names that they have in the Japanese version. So the North American version has a different name and the different voice actors and all kinds of like it's very different. Wow. As far as, like, the dialogue goes. Also, I believe that the two main characters in this game are voiced by the same people who do Ash and Misty from the Pokemon anime, us localization of it.

Yeah.

Which is super interesting.

Yeah.

It sounds like you can kind of tell they're doing their Ash and Misty.

Yeah. They're just like, we're not doing anything extra. We're just doing that.

Yeah. But this game was developed by Japan Studio.

What a clever name.

I know, but it's weird. So I kind of familiar with Japan Studio because they have done a lot of assist development work with from Soft. So they assisted on the development of Bloodborne and Demon Souls, and I think possibly the first Dark Souls.

Oh, interesting.

But they have a pretty extensive history in being, like, an auxiliary developer for incredible games.

Wow. Okay.

And Japan Studio itself is formed by a bunch of internal development teams that were being disbanded, then reorganized and spun off into their own studio, like Team Eco, eco Shadow, the Colossus, Last Guardian, project Siren, which did Siren, of course, and Forbidden Siren Two, Siren, Blood Curse. But they did all the Gravity Rush games, too.

I love those games. Me, too.

I haven't played Gravity Rush, too, if I don't play the first one. And the Remaster, but very good. But Japan studio themselves, they did the Knack games.

Okay.

Which are weird games.

Sure.

And I always appreciate a good weird game. Mr. Mosquito, they've done all the Ape Escape games, including the Ape Academy games, and there's a lot there's way more APESCAPE games than you think.

Right.

Which you'd think that since there are so many of them, we'd, like, have them still. It'd be a franchise that's still live.

Yeah.

But Japan Studio also responsible for I mean, now, I guess it's not underrated, but when it came out, very underrated. Legend of Dragoon.

Okay. They're fucking witches.

Whips. That is the game that got me interested in JRPGs.

Okay.

And that kind of got led me towards, like, Final Fantasy games.

Okay.

Because the only Final Fantasy games I'd played up to that point were, like, the Game Boy games. I hadn't played seven.

Oh, you hadn't played seven. Okay. Wow. Okay.

I played, like, the Game Boy games, which aren't even real Final Fantasy games. They're not really they're Saga games.

Yeah.

But they also assisted on some of the core PlayStation One games. Jump and Flash paraphra the rapper. They've been around. Now, if I understand correctly, they are no longer around.

Okay.

Which is sad.

Yeah. I think it's pretty sad. Yeah.

Because they have so much stuff. They did. Astros playroom the PS five game.

Fuck, that's good.

Which is like the best built in pack in, pre installed game ever.

I cannot disagree. I think that is the best built in game I can remember, at least.

Yeah. It's very good.

Yeah. And the way that it highlights the controller but is still a fun game. Usually those are just like, tech demos, look what the fucking shit our stuff can do. But you're like, no, this is a fun game. This is legitimately a fun game.

And it definitely is that, too. It is a tech demo, too, because it is the best game for the.

Dual Sense controller and no other game comes close to all the abilities.

Yeah, it's pretty sick. Which, I mean, going back to APESCAPE, the first one that required the use of the dual shot controller.

They're all about the fucking controller, man.

Yeah. They love a good controller.

They loves them some controller.

Yes, they do. The director of Apiscape Two was noato ota. Okay, I want to say that's it. I'm going to say that.

Let's say that's it.

Yeah. But another interesting thing about this one is that North America, right? So all previous APESCAPE games and all Abescape games after this in North America would be published by Sony. But this one but this one published by Ubisoft. Ubisoft in North America, but published by Sony throughout the rest of the world.

That's a weird thing.

It's super weird.

Yeah.

Which is maybe why the PS Four version is the Pal version.

Yeah. They'd want to put theirs not the Ubisoft version. That makes sense.

Yeah. Maybe, like, part of the publishing deal they owned, maybe the voice rights.

That could be. That makes sense.

Yeah.

Ubisoft's just like fucking a bad penny. Like, you go back into fucking the kind of earlier eras of gaming, and you're like, oh, they did this. You know what I mean? They've become like, they did this.

That shit sucks.

This sucks. Or, oh, this wasn't bad. I'm surprised they had anything to do with anything good.

Yeah. And they're huge. I mean, they're massive.

Yeah.

They've been around forever, since 1986, when they made Zombie for the Amstrad CPC. So other than that, there's not a ton on the development of this game.

Sure.

So let's get to the story of this game, which, like, the first one is slim.

Slim is a good word. Yeah, that's a good word for it.

It's almost the same story. Can you see me? All right, I have a favor to ask you while I'm away. Could you use the transporter to where did they get to, anyway? Send these newly designed packs to Monkey Park for me. Yes, that's right. So basically, the game starts out where.

You Jimmy is it Jimmy?

Yeah, it's Jimmy. It's hikari to me.

It's Jimmy.

Yeah. The game starts out where you Jimmy, who is the cousin of Spike, who, of course, is the protagonist in the first game, and Natalie, the granddaughter of the professor. The professor, the dude who really is at the core of every fuck up in this franchise.

Right.

And he through FaceTime a zoom call. Yeah. Through a Zoom call, tells Jimmy, you got to ship these monkey pants with this transport array to Ape Island. Monkey park.

Monkey park. That's right.

Where the monkeys are. You got to ship them these pants. Monkeys get pants. They can't be running around with their dongs out. That's not how we do things around these barts.

Right.

So Jimmy, being the lazy sack of shit preteen he is, not only sends the pants, but accidentally sends them monkey helmets. And anyone who's played the first Ape.

Escape game or knows anything about zoology yeah.

Knows that monkey helmets bad fucking news.

Bad fucking news for monkeys and the world.

Yes. Bad, bad news. Because, of course, the antagonist from the first game, Specter, who is an evolved.

Ape, okay, I had a question about that, and I was wondering if it was in the first game, because they refer to as him an ape, but he seems to just be a guy with the care covering, like, emo haircut.

He's like an emo monkey, but he's a monkey.

He doesn't look like a monkey. Right. I'm not wrong there.

I'm pretty sure he's a monkey.

No, I think he is. I'm just saying at first glance, I didn't understand how he was a monkey, I guess, would be my question.

Because, hey, we all share. We have a shared ancestor with all the great apes.

Fully agree.

Fully. We're all just monkeys on this floating rock called Earth.

We are. Yeah. I'll accept that. It just was a little confusing for a first timer. Was his name Specter? When he showed up on the screen talking shit, and then Natty was like, oh, it's that monkey Specter again. And I was like, Wait.

Oh, no.

Yeah. Wait. What? He's a monkey. Okay.

Yeah, it was a real fuck up on the professor's part. Not euthanizing Specter in the yeah, he.

Should have got rid of him.

Absolutely. A mistake he would make once again, in Ape Escape Two, and I'm sure.

In every game in the series yeah.

This guy, he won't die.

He just won't die.

So, of course, Specter gets a hold of one and uses the technology of the monkey helmets to command an army of apes to escape.

Yes.

And escape they do. And it's your job as the fuck up who caused this to go use the warp tunnel.

Sure.

To go to various areas and catch these damn apes.

Just catch them.

These damn dirty apes.

Damn dirty apes.

Damn you all to hell.

Yeah.

And you got to catch them. And not only do you got to catch these apes, you have to defeat Specter, but before you can even get.

To Specter oh, yeah, he's got these.

Guys you have to defeat and capture the freaky monkey five course.

I mean course.

Which are monkeys that don't just have your regular pants. No, they do not just have regular pants. They have special pants.

They have special pants and special abilities.

Yeah. All kinds of special abilities. And you have to do this because Specter's massive plan, which is low key brilliant, is he has created a laser beam.

Sure.

A friggin laser laser beam that he plans on shooting from space, called the Lethargy Laser, that will make everyone on Earth just too lazy to do anything about him taking over the planet with monkeys, which is like, villainry at its finest.

Oh, it absolutely is.

It is a simple solution to a complicated problem.

Right. Remove our will to resist.

Yeah. It's not trying to stop us. It's not trying to stop us from defeating him. It's trying to stop us from even trying to defeat him, which is that's just high level thinking.

That's high level, especially for an evolved ape.

This is Alpha mindset.

Absolutely. This is Andrew Tate, I believe.

Yes. This is alpha gorilla mindset.

Yes.

At its finest.

Oh, absolutely.

So he creates this coterie of monkeys that are like his bodyguards, kind of. His lieutenants called the freaky monkey Five. And they become insane because of these Vita Z bananas, these special, special bananas that make them go wild. Of course, there's a big fat monkey, which is hilarious, who can't stop eating the bananas and ends up getting super big and just fucking jack. Yeah, very fun. But what this does is it does something that the first game doesn't, which it gives this game, like legitimate boss fights.

Yeah.

And these are boss fights in the same way that like Crash Bandicoot has boss fights.

Yeah.

This isn't fucking Dark Souls. This is like move, don't get hit. And then bonk them on the head when you can.

Yeah. Use your latest kind of power thing. Yeah.

And of course, at the end, Specter actually, this is kind of a cool thing that lengthens the gameplay of this game. At the end, you defeat Specter. Right. But if you haven't collected every single monkey, he gets out. And then to get the true ending, you have to collect every single monkey, every single fuck. And then you finally capture him.

Right. For good. And I didn't know where I was going to mention this. I didn't play through the whole game.

Amateur.

I know. They gave a unique name to every single monkey in this game, I believe.

Oh, it's incredible. There's, like, a Tom Cruise monkey. Clint Apewood.

Yeah. That was someone's job to write down. They got a fucking Word document with just write down names. That's probably the most impressive thing in the game to me, is that every time I rescued a monkey, and again, I didn't get that far into the game, it was a different name. They never repeat it.

It's Loki. Incredible. Yeah. It is one of the best parts of the game. You got to respect that level of commitment.

I fully do.

I fully respect it. But let's get on. Speaking of speaking of capturing monkeys, let's talk about the gameplay.

Wow, a white monkey. What vector. Oh, no, it's happening again. Doesn't look like he's bothering anyone. Beckha is a smart one. We don't know what he might do if he uses his powers to take.

Control over the other monkeys gameplay. So this game controls the exact same it is the exact same controls as the first game.

And it controls I got to say, it controls well.

Yeah, it controls pretty good very well. There is some goofy camera shit always, but that's I mean, it's I mean, 2002. Yeah, exactly. This game was developed in 2001. If it came out in 2002 in Japan. So this game was developed in 2001. Goofy camera shit is bound to be, of course, issue. Yeah, you can't it's also weird having trigger buttons be jump.

But that was a thing I remember. There's another game we did that had.

That, and it's just but either way, this game controls pretty slick. It feels pretty good. You kind of swing the right joystick in the direction of what you want to whip. Whatever your what they're called? What are they called? Gotcha Gadgets.

The gadgets, yeah.

You got gotcha gadgets So it's like your net. You have like a stun thing. You have like a little radar.

You have, like, underwater dually bobby thing. Yeah.

You got a hula hoop that makes you run fast. You got a thing, spin it, and like a helicopter. All kinds of cool shit. And you use the right joystick to whip it at a monkey. And you use the left joystick to move. What more do you want?

Nothing.

And the whole game, you're accompanied you're accompanied by a little baby monkey who's a good monkey, though. He's one of the good ones, named Papucci Italian. And he helps your ass out because if you fall off some shit, he'll be like, Wait, no, because he has wings, which is sick. Yeah. And if you die, he'll be like, oh, let me resuscitate to you.

Because he's Italian.

Yes, of course. He's Depotchi the flying a baby monkey.

Now, do you feel like I have not gotten deeper into these games, but I feel like he's ripe to be a villain in later games.

I don't think so. He goes away in the middle of this game. And I would say when he goes away, the game gets harder.

Much harder. Yeah.

Not having him as, like, a crutch. It's very much in the same vein. And I get a lot of Crash bandicoop vibes from this game.

100%.

Especially the loading music. The loading music is, like, basically the same. But also I feel like bullochi is kind of like the UGA buga mask.

Yes, a little bit. I also found a good similarity in its relationship to violence. It felt very similar. Like, when you hit someone and crashed. There's a certain style of it's.

A bonk.

Yeah. And there's a bonk in this, too. Like when a monkey's getting a little he's getting a little too big for his britches and he doesn't want to get captured. And you got to give him a little bit of what for. Yeah.

You got to give him the business.

You got to check him when you do that. I feel very similar to when you hit something and crash. It had that same kind of feel.

Yeah. Like a boink. A bonk rolling. Yeah. No, it's very satisfying. Which is funny because some of these monkeys have bombs and guns and banana peels. Oh, my God. But some of them are dressed as Frenchmen some of them are dressed as pharaohs or jesters. They got all kinds of skills that will keep you from catching them.

They do. They get a lot. Like if you think you know what this game is in level like one, two, and three. I think one in level four was the first time. I think he's the one with the banana peels where you're like, okay, so this isn't going to be a cakewalk. It's not going to be just platforming. Some of these monkeys are going to put up a bit of a fucking fight.

Yeah. And it has a bit of backtracking because some stages have monkeys you cannot get to until you get gotcha gadgets from another level. Correct. So you got to go back. So in a way, this kind of reminds me a little bit of Mario 64 hot take.

Okay, sure.

Honestly, I think level design wise, this kind of feels a little Mario 64.

Okay, I guess I'm with you. I'm with you.

Think about Mario 64. You hop into the portrait, you run. Like, the stages aren't massive.

No, they're not. But these aren't either.

Yeah. And there's some good verticality in the levels. The controls are not exactly working with you.

No.

Neither is the camera. And it kind of relies a little bit on inertia. Right. Like, you get going. You got to keep going.

So interesting observation that I did not work out when I was playing it.

If I'm absolutely full of shit, someone please check me. But I would beg someone listening to play Mario 64, if you can, on original hardware. So you get the feeling of using that single joystick and then play this game and tell me that it doesn't feel there's not a similar feel to it.

Yeah.

You're trying to get stars. You're getting coins.

Yeah.

Think of the apes as stars that can just run away from you and.

Throw fucking banana peels.

Yeah.

Shoot. The inertia thing is interesting. I'd have to, like you say, plaid have to play Mario 64 in original hardware to really make but it's starting to feel like it makes a lot of sense what you're saying.

Yeah. And maybe that's why I like this game. I really like Mario 64 a lot, but there's a lot and there's a lot of gadgets that help you out, and that's really what it is. But the cool thing about this game, if this game were just going through each of these levels, collecting all of the apes, there would not be much to this game. There's not that many levels. It doesn't take that long to kind of get through the main campaign area. So this game has a couple of things to help with that. It has a new Game Plus, which is sick.

It is.

New. Game plus was still, like, a relatively novel thing at this stage of video games. But you can play a spike who is the hero from the first game and you have all the gadgets from the get go. And you can replay the game as the original protagonist and just basically like speed run it. Yeah, it's doing the infinite ammo thing. Yeah, you do like another run with Infinite Ammo. But there's also like there's three side games, three little mini games.

Minigames.

And the minigames are pretty sick.

Fucking TV.

Okay, so there's three, right? There's a soccer game. It's called monkey soccer.

Yeah.

There's Dance Monkey Dance, which is a fun rhythm game, which there's Monkey Climber, which I think is the weakest.

Yeah.

Monkey Climber is just like going across vines. It's kind of difficult purely based because of the graphics are a little clunky with it. Yeah, that's the worst one. The soccer game is pretty fun, though. Kind of reminded me of Mega Man. Soccer and dance, monkey dances. I mean, it's just a rhythm, just rhythm game. But it's fun. And it's a lot of replayability to this game. Yes. I mean, other than going back and collecting all the monkeys so you can see all their names.

Yeah.

Which is cool.

Yeah, very cool.

APESCAPE Two. It came out in a time where there were still these kind of and it's one of the things that makes the PS Two so great, right, is game developers were not just trying to make some huge AAA game that was going to fucking sell a trillion copies.

Correct.

They would take risks. They would take swings, they would make goofy games. They would make sequels to goofy fun games. And this is why it's like kind of my favorite area of video games. I love the era of paraphra of jetset. Radio ape Escape These kind of games to me are very fun and have huge nostalgia value. I mean crazy taxi. Come on. And it's why I'm loki. I'm a pretty big Sega fan. And that's just like at this point in time, these kind of games were still huge. And we still have that a little bit in the indie space. The indie space. Now, I also don't think it's more and this is not shitting on indie games. There's a lot of great indie games.

Sure.

But like Stardew Valley. But Stardew Valley is very clearly and the developer would tell you the same is very clearly a Harvest Moon clone.

Of course. Yeah.

And I would think a lot of indie games are just trying to make more fun versions of old games or like updated.

Updated.

Yeah. They're not taking like massive swings. Like, there's a ton of metroidania indie games. There's a ton of Shovel Knight kind of clones. There's a ton of Isometric Dungeon Crawler kind of shit, which I love. Like Cignalis. I'll give a shout out to Cignalis. That game is sick.

Yeah.

If you're just looking for a game that can capture kind of like PS One era survival horror, that game is doing it okay. Doesn't control like resident Evil doesn't necessarily look like that kind of thing, but it nails the tone entirely, which is great. Or a blackwood.

Another good one.

Kind of in that same vein. Sure. With APESCAPE too. I mean, these games just are goofy and fun.

Just fun.

They don't take themselves seriously. And I would love to see a resurgence of APESCAPE. I would love to see a remaster. That'd be fun. We got the Insane trilogy remaster from Crash.

Yeah.

We got the Riptoes trilogy remaster from Spyro.

Spyro.

Give us APESCAPE one, Two and Three remastered Why not? Yeah.

You have nothing to lose on that.

People would go fucking wild for that.

100% updated. Like better camera controls, better graphics. Obviously.

Give it the full remake treatment that you gave those games. Because I put APESCAPE right up there with Crash Bandicoot and Spyro, right? Definitely Spyro. I think Crash Bandicoot is the best of these 100%. But APESCAPE is a very good game. And APESCAPE, too. I was surprised just how much I enjoyed it because I didn't really play it when it came out. Yeah, but it is a lot of fun. But hey, what the fuck do we know? What did the critics say?

Oh, shit. That transition.

I'll give up my evil ways if.

You can beat me. Okay, then let's settle this. I'm going to spank you, monkey.

So, there's not a ton of reviews on this game, but on Metacritic, it has a very admirable score of 82 out of 100.

Okay.

Famitsu, when it was released, gave it a 32 out of 40.

Not bad.

Yeah. And Game Spot gave it an 8.4 out of ten and said the game's relative ease is offset by the sheer number of weird unlockable items. And the end result is a platform game that is, above all, great fun. Right. Which I mean is fuck yeah.

Indeed. That's right. Yeah.

IGN gave it actually a nine out of ten, saying more than anything, the inescapable level of addiction in collecting Monkeys is the overriding reason to not just rent, but to buy and cherish this game. Which is.

A huge endorsement. Yeah.

Oh, my God. Now, like we said at the top of the show, you can play this on the PS Classics collection on a PS Four or a PS Five. But I will give a caveat on this. Obviously, we said it's the pal version, right? There is also some and I mean, this is a reoccurring theme with a lot of these PS Two games playing them on PS Five or PS Four. There is some bugginess to it. There's a lot of visual bugs, there's a lot of clipping, there's a lot of wall, like breaking. It does some weird stuff sometimes with the saving, with a virtual memory card. PS Two games, for some reason, are just impucking, possible to emulate on consoles. But you can play this game. And I do recommend you play this game, especially. I fully recommend it being available on that. I mean, it's worth it if you already have, like, a PS network subscription to just download it and try it. Yeah, download the original Ape Escape and try it. I think you can download the third one and play it, too. I think they're all kind of available on there. And if you have a PSP hell, try to find the Ape Academy ones, which I also think might be available. They've done a great job of keeping these games available, which is great.

Yeah.

Which is awesome. So download it. Download this motherfucker.

Download that motherfucker.

Okay. Ian.

Yes.

How are you rating this game?

All right, I am going to give Ape Escape two. Eight out of ten monkey pants.

Eight out of ten monkey pants. You stole my rating system. I knew I would do monkey pants.

Of course you were. How would you not? So it's just fun. It controls well. I think the sign of a really good game like this is the clock test, where you're like, oh, shit. I've been playing for 2 hours. That happened to me playing this. I did not realize how much time had passed, and I wasn't like, oh, I've beaten six levels. I beat the first boss, and I think I beat the second one, yellow monkey. And before I knew it, it was like, two and a half hours. Like, Holy shit, I have to stop playing. I have to feed my dogs and have my own dinner. It's immersive. Not because you're like, oh, the story. It's immersive because it's just fun to play. Like, there's something about the connections between your hand on the controller where it's just a pleasing thing to do.

Yeah. It has a super satisfying gameplay loop.

Yes. 100%.

Which is why I'm going to give.

It.

Eight and a half out of ten pharaoh monkeys.

Pharaoh monkeys. Very good. Very good.

Because it's that same feeling that you get in Crash Bandicoop.

Sure.

It's that same feeling that you kind of get in Jump and Flash in Mario 64. It's super satisfying. It's not overly intensive to think about, so you can kind of autopilot on it. And the aesthetic of it is pleasant enough to keep you kind of from being annoyed. Right. The music is fun. The sound effects are unintrusive, but they feel good. The controls aren't too complicated or a pain in the ass. The game's not too hard, but it's not so easy that you're just, like, coasting through it all. It requires just a scotch of critical thinking and that kind of stuff. I think that's for a lot of people, the biggest thing they look for in a video game, because there's great things about these big games like God of War and Resident Evil and the Eldon Ring. Right. Where they take a lot of commitment and they take a lot of brain power. But I think video games overall, this game is. Aggressively accessible.

Yeah, that's a great way of saying it. Yeah, it is.

And I think that that's what makes it great. And I think that's what makes this franchise great. Now, I haven't played every Ape Escape game, but I have played a bunch of them, and they're all kind of the same and they're all kind of great for the exact same reason.

Just fun. People play games for different reasons, but the end of the day, fun is probably the number one reason for most people. Right?

Absolutely. And it's hard to not like a game that a ten year old could love and that people in their 30s can have a good time with as well. Absolutely. That's what makes just a good game.

All right, well, that was Ape Escape and our take on it. Thank you. Escape the Apes. Thank you so much for listening. Don't forget to like and subscribe vote in our Spotify polls. Do all the stuff.

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I'm at Ian Golding Games.

And you can also find us on whatnot slinging games, making tearless dropping hot takes at funeral casual.

Sure.

And thank you for joining us for sequel month. Sequel sequel month. We've got a lot of good we've got a couple more good games coming up.

Or one more.

We got one more good game coming.

We got one more good game coming.

We got one more big good game coming.

It is a big good game.

It's going to be our first dual episode. This game is so important and so huge that it necessitates two full episodes, so look out for that. And feel free to go through our back catalog. We've just released a great episode on Twisted Metal black Marvel versus Capcom Two. Go back and listen to the God of War.

And if for some reason you want to listen to the bad audio of NBA Street, we know some people like that.

Yeah, some people mad. Hey, if you want to hear our first whack at doing a podcast ever, listen to Simpson Skateboarding, which we recorded on my couch with handheld mics. If that's your thing, hey, I won't judge you, and I'll love you for it.

I will judge you and I will not love you for it. That's my thing. I'm very tough to please.

He's the curmudgeonly one on the play, as it's true.

All right, well, thanks again for listening. We'll see you next week. Baraboom. Barabay.